THIS POST IS STICKIED UNTIL TOMORROW – Interbike Coverage below.
I was recently out East for a trip and ended up riding the very first set of trails I ever rode back in 1997 in Binghamton, New York. Endwell trails have been around for quite some time now and each year I have been back to New York in the past three years or so I have tried to make plans to shoot there and for some reason it never worked out due to crazy weather, the trails not running or any other of the many reasons…until now. I finally got the chance to shoot there this past weekend. It was rad getting to ride with some of my best friends and then finish the day behind the lens. I took some time to sit down and put together interviews with each of the three main locals that have helped keep Endwell alive past and present. Take a few minutes to get some history on one of the many amazing trail spots on the East Coast. When you are done with that be sure to check out the photogallery right here.
Give the readers your name, age and hometown.
Christopher L. Hancock, 34, from Apalachin, NY but I now reside in Chenango Forks, NY.
When did you first hear about Endwell and when was it that you stuck your first shovel in the ground there?
I think it was the summer of ’95 that our crew first heard of the jumps in Endwell. At the time we were digging at a place 10 minutes from Endwell. We went and checked them out one day. There wasn’t much there, but the land area was great and full of potential. I believe it was the summer of ’96 we first started digging there and modifying. The original Endwell crew was moving on to bigger things and so we took the place over. The initial layout they had was the typical hit a jump, pedal, hit another, and pedal some more. We transformed all of that to the newer style rhythm.
Having a trail spot that lasts over 15 years is pretty amazing. The trails weren’t necessarily going full force since then but still something has always existed there throughout changes in the scene over the years, throughout the hard times and floods and all of the other bullshit that maybe kept them from running here and there. Why don’t you give a brief history of the changes that the trails have been through. You have been there since day one so you have seen it all.
In the beginning we had a pretty serious crew. All of us were 16-19 years old or so and ready to go. We had no idea how to really build a solid jump, but we definitely moved some dirt in a short time. As time went on the crew got smaller. At one point the trails were pretty much non-existent. Just about when the trails were really hurting with almost no builders John moved to the area. We had known each other from back during our racing days. I knew he would be a perfect fit for Endwell! I remember talking to him on the roll in at East Coast Terminal the first time I saw him in town. I drove him to where the trails were located that night. That definitely brought Endwell back to life. John is the most motivated person I know when it comes to digging and it’s contagious.
Since we are right near the Susquehanna River it floods all the time, at least once a year. There have been times when the whole spot is under ten or more feet of water. I think that discourages a lot of people. We honestly spend most of the summer digging and rebuilding. Then at the end of the summer we session the trails until winter comes and we can’t ride anymore. A lot of people don’t want to invest that much shovel time and so little ride time. To us we have just as much fun digging as we do riding so it’s all good.
What is it that keeps you going back after all of these years?
I just enjoy spending time down there with friends. Its fun and never gets old. There is something about those woods that just makes me happy. I like knowing that we created something from just plain dirt. I still enjoy how the trails evolve each year. Even in the terms of how we build them evolves every year. This year with Kyle and John we really have an efficient method of building a solid jump in a short time. People think we are crazy, but we really have a method to everything. Our dirt is pretty weird to work with sometimes. It took years to be able to “read” the dirt and know where it will work the best.
There are days when we leave the trails soaked with sweat, covered in dirt and dead mosquito blood, hands, feet and back sore, and just all around fatigued. But as we are walking out looking back at a jump, or berm that we just finished; it makes it all worth it. We made that thing with our own hands, laughed and joked while doing it, and soon we will ride it. It’s a winning situation all around.
Obviously it’s not hard to tell that the scene at the trails is kind of quiet these days but the way they are kept up makes me think otherwise. How do you guys keep them going with such a small crew?
John, Kyle and I have talked about this. We are all pretty sure we have a type of Obsessive Compulsive Disorder that applies to the trails! We have to have things perfect. We do what needs to be done. In the beginning of the season when everything is a mess we all share a sense of anxiety. We have to get stuff fixed fast or else there is no feeling of completion. After lines begin coming together we all start having a feeling of accomplishment. John Paul said that we all have mental illness, I’m pretty sure he’s right.
What’s up with the carpets?
The carpets work perfect for our dirt. Our dirt needs water, but not too much. Tarps don’t allow any water thru to the actual dirt. The carpets allow rain to pass thru to the dirt, but it’s controlled. If our jumps are exposed open to the rain they erode really fast and get rough in no time. The carpets allow the rain through but not enough to erode. We also use the carpets to keep the moisture in a jump so it doesn’t dry out. We have it down to where we use different carpets depending on how much rain or moisture we want to have in that jump. Sometimes we will rip the net off the backside of the carpet and use that also. It’s not as effective as a carpet, but depending on the need will still work. Carpets bring in destructive worms sometimes, nets don’t. Also the carpets are free; we are sponsored by the local carpet place’s dumpster.
How is it dealing with the weather overall?
Some years Mother Nature hates the trails and other years she is cool with it. In 2011 she shut us down for the year at the beginning of September. This summer has been great though. It’s too much rain that kills us, but we can always get water from the river if it’s too dry. During the summer I look at the weather channel every day looking to see what’s coming and try to plan for it.
Do some of the same jumps still exist from the early days?
Definitely. The “Main” line has been revised and built up over the years, but has been there since the beginning. In the early days we made two landings in a row with buried couches (we didn’t know any better at the time). Those two sets are still there today and the couches are still in there somewhere.
Before I got to the trails you recently had a jam and said some people were having a bit of trouble getting through some of the lines there. What is the deal with that and why do you think the trails give some people problems?
Most trails these days are downhill. Our stuff is basically flat, with a couple elevation changes. Our dirt will never get as hard and fast as most trails. You really have to pump at our trails to make it through the lines. You can hit everything at our spot by pedaling at the most two cranks, but the down side is you have to pump almost every set to keep going. Also we have built in “Squirrel Catchers” that weed out some of the kids that don’t know what they are doing. It saves the jumps and the kids from getting hurt. We have been talking recently about revising the beginning to make it more user friendly. We will see what happens next year.
How often do you guys get together to ride?
“Usually at least five nights a week we are down there. John gets uneasy if we leave the trails alone for more that two days in a row! Until recently we all had full time jobs, so typically we would meet up after work and dig/ride until dark. Our crew gets along really well so we all hang out as much as possible, even if it’s not riding.
If you had to guess, over the years have you spent more time riding or more time digging?
Digging, definitely. The jumps don’t build themselves!
Seeing how the history of the trails runs pretty deep, what does the future have in store for Endwell moving forward?
Hopefully just more good times. Like I said earlier, we are throwing around ideas to revise the beginning to make them more user-friendly. That might happen next year. We have tried this year to use more grass/weeds on the 3 non-riding surfaces of the jumps. Hopefully the roots from that will make the jumps more flood resistant allowing us to rebuild faster. Every year we learn more and more about what works and what doesn’t.
Who decides on what to build and where?
We all collectively decide on what gets done. I like some of the bigger hips, floater sets and manual lines. John hates just straight doubles in a row. He is more into non-conventional jumps. Kyle likes everything. We try to blend all of our interests together and end up with a good end result. I think that since our crew all enjoys riding the same type of jumps it all works out for us.
Some of the lines are super unique and some feature tech rollers, vertical berms and more. What trails have influenced the way you guys build?
Ever since the beginning of Endwell we were all racers first. When I started racing I didn’t even know about trails and dirt jumps. Even today we all have a strong racing background it shows with how we build the trails. It’s no fun just riding a boring double over and over again. We all need variety. That’s the beauty of building your own stuff. Build whatever you want! Maybe it will suck; maybe it will be awesome. We like to make our stuff not the norm. As far as influences go I personally would say that 7-11 (RIP) and Oak Park (RIP) were definitely thought of in the early days of Endwell. Minersville (RIP) was also an influence in the way that Shawn and his crew ran that spot. Anytime I go to a trail spot I enjoy looking at the place as much as I do riding it. I like seeing how different people build things differently. Going to POSH or Catty definitely makes you look at dirt in a different way. I think every single trail spot I have been to influences the way we create Endwell.
How about a quick top three just for kicks…
Trail Spots
1. Endwell
2. Minersville (RIP)
3. POSH
Digging secrets
1. Keeping dirt from sticking the shovel makes stacking and packing a lot easier.
2. We spent just as much time packing and we do building. Packing is really important for our type of dirt. Stacking the dirt works way better for us than just tossing.
3. Make sure everybody is on the same page working towards the same goal. We are really fortunate that we don’t have trail drama. We are just dudes that like digging and riding bikes.
Trail riders
1. Mike Tagliavento. He was always fun to ride with and watch and he definitely had an influence on my riding.
2. Brandon (Punjab) Pundai. In my early days of riding I really liked his style of riding.
3. Brian Foster. No description needed, it’s BF.
Trail videos
1. 1201. I didn’t realize it at the time, but it pretty much changed me for the rest of my life. I watched it twice in a row the first night I had it.
2. Dirt Bros Cheese. This was the first real BMX video I ever saw (GT 4130 The Code was actually the first video I ever saw, but that doesn’t count). Watching Cheese blew me away.
3. RAD. I know it’s not technically a trail video, but it is what made me and all my friends want to ride a bike.
How about you give us a crazy story from the trails.
There are definitely too many to pick just one. I have seen everything from random “river people” passing out down there to “Off Duty” cops shooting their guns. Luckily the muddy tunnel at the entrance keeps most of the sketchy people out. We always enjoy the people that come down there and are just amazed about everything. It seems to be a hard concept that we are the ones that created and built the place. Some people just can’t grasp that. One time John had asked an ATV guy “Hey man, can you not park your four-wheeler on that jump? We worked really hard to make that.” To which the guy responds, “What jump? This is a jump? I thought the river built all of this.” We always get a laugh from people like that. Some other good ones we have been asked are: Where did you get all the dirt? Who jumps all these? Do you guys get paid to make these?”
Who are some of the most memorable riders that have shared some sessions with you guys at Endwell?
Jimmy Walker and the Trek team came down there way back in the day. That was fun. I missed the day that Fuzzy Hall, Josh Stricker, Mike Aitken, Robbie Morales, Jerry Bagley, and Keith Mulligan came down, but I heard that was a good one. Anytime good people show up it’s a good time. Even a couple weeks ago when the Tree crew, the Credence crew, the Circuit crew, the Heathens crew and a bunch of others came by, it was great!
Lastly, why don’t you take a minute and elaborate on what trails mean to you and give some insight on the type of dedication it takes to get a set of trails up and running.
I know it sounds cliché but that place is more than just some jumps in the woods. It’s what makes me happy. It’s kinda’ like therapy down there. After a cruddy day at work or whatever it the best place to go to relieve all that stress. It’s a great place to burn off some steam. Get rid of some stress, and make a kickass jump at the same time, sounds pretty good to me. In terms of dedication, yea I guess it takes a lot. We always joke around “The trails aren’t building themselves”. If one of us three isn’t into going down there on a certain day, the other two will usually guilt the third into going! We support each other like that!
How about a list of shout-outs and thanks?
I’d like to thank the town of Endwell for letting us be there for years. I’d like to thank the local Burger King for putting up with all of us punk kids in the early days. I’d definitely like to thank anybody that has ever helped shovel, pack, haul water or anything to help us out, it’s greatly appreciated. I’d like to thank my Dad for not getting mad when I used to break his shovels and rakes back in the day. I’d like to thank Rob Kucharek and his crew for basically starting Endwell and passing the torch to us. I’d like to thank my initial Endwell buddies and my current buddies for all the good times! Thanks to FBM Bikes, Profile Racing, and Circuit BMX for helping me out with my current bike. Also thanks to Jeremy for making this happen!
The same deal goes for you. Give the readers your name, age and hometown.
John-Joesph Calvin Lee 4th, I am 34 years old from East Patchogue, New York (Long Island), but I am currently living in Binghamton, New York.
When did you first hear about Endwell and when was it that you stuck your first shovel in the ground there?
I moved to the Binghamton Area in September 28, 1999 for college at Suny Binghamton. I ask around about the trails my first time at the East Coast Terminal skate park, and the next day I was down there shovel-in-hand digging.
How did you end up as a full-fledged local and what kind of history do you have down there?
When I moved up the trails were almost abandoned, since the opening of the skatepark the locals at the time lost interest. I have always had a local trail spot so it was 2nd nature to just start working on another spot. I dug at Endwell from 1999-2002, moved to NYC for a few years, then moved back to he area some point in 2006 the trails were abandoned again and became victim to dirt bikes and ATV’s. Chris, Cruz, and Chunk started to dig back at an older spot in Westover. We dug there for two seasons, but the spot flooded really easy and lacked good natural landscape. In 2008 Chris and I were the only ones still digging and we went back to digging at Endwell, and are finally getting the place back to normal.
If you had to choose between riding the most amazing skatepark you have ever seen and the best trails out there, blue-groove lips and all; which would you choose and why?
I would ride the trails, I like being in the woods.
How has the scene at the trails evolved over the years?
Our trail scene hasn’t changed much, we’ve had some locals come and go. Kyle is new guy in and became a local in 2010. We found the value of a good clay pit for topcoat, and we are using much more fill dirt to encourage vegetation growth to hold things together when the trails flood. We just keep trying new techniques to learn what works best for our spot.
How has trail riding in general evolved over the years since you’ve been riding in general?
Trails in general have changed drastically. Everyone has figured out better building techniques, which has allowed for more creative lines and jumps. I also think the era of the “Trail Nazi”, and no dig no ride policies has chilled out and the trail community is open to new comers. Jumps are built much better today and are less likely to get blown out. On the flip side trails have gotten more intricate and it’s harder for new comers to just roll in and ride.
Who puts in the most shovel-time at the trails?
It’s not about who puts more time in, its about being there when it counts and working effectively as a group.”
You guys seem to have quite the system worked out with the carpets and all of that and almost have keeping the trails down to somewhat of a science. Does that just come with years of experience?
Every trails spot is different, we have learned from trial and error what works best for our spot, and learn from other trail communities what works well for them.
How do you feel about it being such a small scene at the moment? How do you stay motivated to keep going?
I am cool with it being a small scene, we are good group of friends and work well together, I would rather not have people/riders at the trails that I wouldn’t want to hang out with, just for the sake of having another person to ride or dig with. There is certain amount of supervision that takes place when someone doesn’t know how to build or doesn’t work with the crew. There is method to how we build so we don’t get ahead ourselves and can manage. It is easy to stay motivated, you just need to look at what you created with your friends. Creating your spot is as much fun as riding it.
Tricks or flow? Which do you prefer and why?
I would have to say neither, it’s more about feel and fun. If you hit a set and feels good to do some trickery then let it fly. If taking a crank half way up a lip and getting stiff and barely making it out alive keeps you stoked then more power to you just don’t mess up the jumps.
Where do you see Endwell in five years?
My five year plan would be to have some teenagers holding down the fort. At the rate we are going we can only manage 1-2 more full lines with the three of us. If I had my way in five years the trails would focus running in and out of the natural ravine, and we would use some of the natural landscape a little better. Then mellow out some of the current lines to make them a bit more forgiving.
How about a quick top three just for kicks…
Trail Spots
1. Panamoka
2. POSH
3. Catty
Digging secrets
1. Clean your shovel
2. Stack it then pack it
3. Be able to read your dirt, Regulate your moisture, don’t let things dry to fast or they will crack, or build when it is to wet because the core will take for ever to dry out.
Trail riders
1.Keith Terra
2. Clint Reynolds
3. Brian Foster
Trail videos
1. Anthem 1& 2
2. Building the Underground
3. Muthafuckin Dirt
I mentioned that some of the lines are super unique and some feature tech rollers, vertical berms and more. What trails have influenced the way you guys build?
It’s bits and pieces of things we have built and ridden over the years and spots we went to. Oak park, 7-11 trails, Panamoka, Catty, Posh, Minersville, The Ravine, Bo Ushers’s etc…They all have influenced our building.
It seems as though you guys have a big race influence going on there as well. Did you put some time in at the track when you were younger?
Yes, Chris and myself grew up racing and riding trails, Kyle has some racer in him but is a different generation of racer. As much as going high and jumping is fun, manuals, bump jumps, roller combos are just as much fun. It’s nice figuring out different ways though certain sections.
What’s the deal with everyone saying Endwell is hard to ride? And, for the curious ones, what makes it seem so difficult to some riders?
Endwell starts off on flat ground, you have to generate your speed with a few rollers and berms and some pump here and there. Its not just coasting down hill or some x-games looking roll in. It keeps the riff raff out.
As Kelly Baker said “Dude, you either have the skill-set to ride it or you don’t.”
Why don’t you take a minute and elaborate on what trails mean to you and give some insight on the type of dedication it takes to get a set of trails up and running.
Trail riding is section nature to me, I grew up in a area where most small crews had there own spots and we would create what were wanted to ride. There were no public skateparks and our street riding consisted of empty parking lots manuals and curb cuts. You and your friends were responsible for creating what you wanted to ride. Your spot is a reflection of yourself and what your willing to put in.
Trails are very time consuming. It’s like having a second job, or like having children. You have to check on them, nurture them, water them when they are thirsty, tuck them in at night. The trail season window is a short one in the North East and varies depending on the weather. At times its means digging before and after work to finish up a section or beat the rain. It is important to just being there, prevents wanders, children, ATV’s from accidentally harming your spot. There is also a lot of patience involved and, if you starting a new spot it’s going to be three years until things really start coming together. Your girlfriend or wife is going to be pissed at you.
Trail builders are a weird-breed. We are mainly older dudes who look half homeless and half naked in the woods beating dirt with shovels after work and on weekends. While most people go to the gym to workout before or after work we dig holes, run wheelbarrows and ride bikes. Other people go out on Saturday night to bar or club do something social but typically we are to exhausted from eight hours of digging and all you want is a shower and some food. But more importantly it’s about having fun in the woods with your friends making something out of nothing for the cost of a shovel and your time.
How about a list of shout-outs and thanks?
Thanks To Chris and Kyle for being at the trails when it counts, Endwell Rug, for the having easy access dumpster, the greater trail community for inspiration and acceptance. Stew Johnson for being a sweet dude and Making Anthem videos, Brian Foster for not slowing down and showing it just keeps getting sweeter.
See you in the woods!
Let us know your name, age and hometown.
Kyle Hibbard, I am 23 years old and I am from Binghamton, New York.
Seeing as how you are the youngest of the locals how did you first hear about Endwell and when did you first start digging down there?
I first heard about the trails a few years into racing so right around when I was 10-12. I didn’t know anyone who went down for a long time but about two and a half years ago I started talking to John and Chris more and got to know them.
What is it like cruising with some of the original locals?
It is awesome and a privilege. I remember being young at East Coast Terminal and watching Chris and John rip around. It pretty crazy to me that those are the guys I hang out with and dig with on a daily basis.
It seems as though you guys all work pretty well together when it comes to building, and working on the trails in general but who do you think puts in the most shovel time?
We all work hard but John kills it down there.
What have you learned over the years that you may not have known otherwise from the more experienced trail crew?
Some general techniques. The big thing is working with carpets. It makes packing tacky, wet dirt much easier. Also, coating the riding surfaces with clay. The dirt I dug with before helping at Endwell was just topsoil and it never lasted long. Also shaping lips and landings, everyone approaches it differently but I have learned quite a bit from the guys.
So, your pup got a photo in here, which means she must be important. Go ahead and give us some details on the young trail pup in training. She seems down for the cause.
She is a 10-week old Australian Cattle dog, and her name is Kaeli. She just started going down a little less than two weeks ago and she loves it.
What’s the trick to riding Endwell incase anyone shows up looking to ride with you guys.
Bring your pump.
Is it a strict “no-dig, no-ride” policy?
That depends on the situation, if you live local it is nice to have some help but everyone has jobs so I am not too concerned. Otherwise, as long as you are respectful and nice it’s all good.
Do you guys let just anyone ride?
If we are down there and you can make it through the jumps it should be okay. Obviously if you are disrespectful you are not starting out on the right foot.
What is your favorite thing about Endwell?
Friends and the time we spend hanging out.
How about a quick top three just for kicks…
Trail Spots
1. Catty
2. Panamoka
3. Posh
Digging secrets
1. Have fun
2. Be ready to work
3. Don’t rush it, take your time
Trail riders
1. Mike Aitken
2. Clint Reynolds
3. Brian Foster
Trail videos
1. Anthem 2
2. Magilla’s part in Thousand Yard Stare
3. Building the Underground
With you being the youngest you have the most potential to keep the trails alive. Where do you see the trails in five years?
I think they will still be going. I definitely will do my best to see that they are, but I am sure Chris and John will still be stacking dirt and cruising right along with me.
What keeps you motivated to dig and ride instead of just go to a skatepark like a lot of the younger riders out there these days?
Being a part of the group. The riding is great but these guys are great people and I am glad they are my friends. Plus having a long session with some friends after digging what you want to ride, feels great.
Can you do your best to explain why trails simply rule?
For me its simple: go fast, pull back, have fun with the guys.
I guess that’s about it, any last words?
Go pick up a shovel, help out the locals, and have some fun.
How about a list of shout-outs and thanks?
Jeremy Pavia for shooting and hanging out and anyone who has let me ride or invited me to their trails.
CHECK OUT THE FULL PHOTOGALLERY RIGHT HERE!
Just like last week, don’t forget that we have a Through the Lens photo contest going on right now that is sponsored by Quintin. And be sure to check back next Wednesday for the thirty-second edition of Through the Lens and as always feel free to leave any questions in the comments section or email me at info@jeremypavia.com and I will hit you back as soon as I can. Feel free to follow me on Twitter and Instagram @jeremypavia.
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